Bear411 Fun

[daddytodd]

Bear411 profile quote: "Don't bother writing if your going to call me boy, boi, pup, son, and kiddo. Newly added word I hate is sport."

OK, how about "asshole?"

Another Bear411 profile quote: "Not looking to meet any one for sex I have someone for that and alot more. His profile on here is XXXXX, Come on guys show a little respect. Taken means NOT LOOKING for any thing more than friends."

In what sense is it "disrespectful" to hit upon someone who has his profile posted on a hook-up site? What am I not getting here?

Comments

[naylandblake.livejournal.com]

1) Clearly they are asking you to call them "Pretty Miss Prissy Pants"

2) "I'm only looking to tell other guys online how great my relationship is, as opposed to theirs"

[bigfootcub.livejournal.com]

you can call me pup or boy all you want daddy!

Or better yet....

[pauliebearsf.livejournal.com]

How about the profiles that state they are not looking to play around with other "open" couples, yet have no problem posting nudes, cock shots, etc....????

[grande.livejournal.com]

is it really only a hook up site though?

i seriously have spent any time outside of a bar / dinner with maybe 1/20th of the people i've met from that place.

i barely give them the time of day, i dunno, i just don't treat it with any degree of seriousness, so i doubt its ever disrespectful, but i can totally see that someone might be interested in something other than being hit on. i know it bores me frequently.

Yes, it's a hook-up site

[daddytodd.livejournal.com]

It's a lot of things, but primarily, yes, it is a hook-up site. Perhaps not as mono-focused as men4sexnow, but still I see the main purpose of posting one's sexy and/or revealing photos online as an attempt to entice others into cyber and/or R/T sex.

Re: Yes, it's a hook-up site

[grande.livejournal.com]

thats a perspective issue then i'd say.

i've specifically posted in my profile i'm not looking for anything in particular, i know thats vague, but its true.

i know some folks take the time to post they aren't looking for sex. if they post that, is it disrespectful to still hit on them? i don't know the answer to that question, but they have all the right in the world to ignore someone that does i'd say. i mean they did post it.

however, i doubt most folks post that with that particular intention. i think, its more of a general tool and disclaimer so folks can get out of being hit on by folks they dont find interesting.

regardless, another mans trash, anothers treasure. its all about boundaries and respecting the ones laid out.

[bitterlawngnome.livejournal.com]

I talk to a lot of people there just socially with no intention of sex; and also for me it's a place to recruit one kind of model I want. But yeah I think a lot of people have confusing/contradictory messages going on and yes it is a site for finding sex - I liken my activity to chatting up people in a cruising park :)

I don't understand why the "don't address me as boy" thing bothers you though. It's just a preference thing, like, you enjoy being called 'daddy" but prob not "boy", or some people pref top or bottom. Maybe there was more to the ad?

The Original Question

[daddytodd.livejournal.com]

I know couples who loudly proclaim how "closed" they are, but under the right circumstances (i.e., they get the chance to play with a "supa-hot guy") and suddenly they find an opening in their "closed" relationship.

Is it the unpleasant whiff of hypocrisy that I object to? Or simply sour grapes that I've not been adjudged sufficiently "supa-hot" to slip through that opening? I don't know the answer.

But back to the original question: In what sense is it "disrespectful" to tell someone you find him attractive and would like to have sex with him? He can always say NO if he's not interested (for whatever reason.)

I state quite plainly in my profiles that I'm not interested in cyber; yet still I get tons of requests for cyber. I recognize the reality that most people don't read profiles; they look at ath pics. If your pics fire off certain neurological responses, guys will hit on you. If you're not interested, say "no thanks" or just ignore them. But don't get all offended 'n' shit; would you rather NOBODY found you attractive or desirable?

[pink-halen.livejournal.com]

I think it could be that Bear411 has become fashionable and "past it". People are using it as a social space like the bars used to be. The bear movement has peaked and the downhill side of things is that Bear411 is populated with non-bears. These people really *DO* miss that point that it was a hookup place.

My partner Ron has been vexed lately by the messages that he has been getting from Bear411 denizens. They write him to say, "You would look handsome without that beard." We are not sure "what part of Bear don't you understand?"

I have never had a Bear411 profile. After I heard about the rule changes and new charges in recent months I'm thinking it may not be worth my while to add a profile. (Yes, I know, Everyone wonders why I don't have a profile.) The truth is that computer sex just doesn't work for me. I want to smell them and feel their warmth. I don't have time for people who get offended when I tell them I think there hot and want to jump their bones. If I want unattainable men I'll go to the hardware store an fantasize about the customers.

[daddytodd.livejournal.com]

I guess I see that as an extension of the "don't say 'woof' or 'grrr' to me" mindset. Why get your knickers in a knot over something innocent; especially when it's meant as a COMPLIMENT, no matter how inelegant the approach.

I don't generally call anyone "boy" unless they first refer to me as "daddy" or they have something in their profile to indicate they will be receptive to a daddy/boy dynamic. But I also recognize that there are lots of bears (and their admirers) with limited social skills, so I don't get offended by simple social gaffes.

[daddytodd.livejournal.com]

I don't think I'll renew my paid subscription to Bear411 next time it comes up for renewal. I don't like it so much any more, either.

Re: The Original Question

[grande.livejournal.com]

well thats what i mean, mostly the statement is a filter they can conveniently use.

however, some folks genuinely tell the truth, and really its not our place to question that.

there are other ways to compliment someone than tell them you want to sleep with them. sure its neat, but we've all heard it more than enough, and if we need to keep hearing it, welll thats our own issue, not someone elses.

someone tells me i'm hot and they want to sleep with me? thats nice. and thats about all i have to say. if someone doesn't have anymore to say, the compliment is about as empty as it get. i understand attraction is the first step of anything, but there are other ways. just other ways.

some folks dont put such a priority on sex, and thats their right. its not really their right to be snappy back about it, i agree, but its really just about as 'right' as telling someone you want to sleep with them when they say they're not interested in advance.

p's and q's. most folks are just being too sensitive. compliments are nice, theres no real reason to overanalyze it, but i dont really take anything on that site too seriously, for all the reasons you and i have said.

[shake-it-up.livejournal.com]

There's an option to label your profile "just chat" or "friends". Personally I think that people should read the profile before pouncing. That does show "respect". When someone has a big come-on that directly contradicts what is in my profile ("boy" turns my stomach) then they can expect a cold response or none at all.

[bigreddee.livejournal.com]

I have to say...if someone is posting a quote like the second one, I take it as the fact that they've already mentioned they're looking for friends only, not just a hook up, and people keep overlooking that. For me personally, it does get a little annoying when my profile says I'm looking for friends and I'm constantly getting woofed at. I mean, yes, the ego is fed and all, but when nothing else is said but, "hey, do you guys play?" you have to try a more direct tact. I mean, there's a reason 411 has a setting that says, "Just Friends". Some people just don't respect that.

[bitterlawngnome.livejournal.com]

LOL well the monickers don't bother me much but there's someone you and I both know quite well whose knickers do a double-twist if he's called "boy" without being asked first ... and sometimes even then :)

True...but then.....

[pauliebearsf.livejournal.com]

there are "JUST FRIENDS" profiles with nudes and penis shots.....Does that mean they want me to be "just friends" with their penis?? (evil grin)....

xoxoxoxoxoxoxo

Re: True...but then.....

[bigreddee.livejournal.com]

And I think that's a whole other story...I actually take mild offense to that kind of profile, because it sends the wrong message. My profile has pics of me, with clothes (LOL), and a pic of my partner. I'll be honest...I use the site to talk to pals on my buddy list, and to look at pics of hot guys. But I don't chat up anyone based on their hotness...if something they say in their profile triggers a response in me, I'll say hello. Not woof, but hello, and go from there. I don't mind someone saying hello because they think I'm attractive, but when they push the "I want to have sex with you" angle, it's annoying, and tells me they didn't bother to read the profile. Which usually tells me it's a waste of my time to respond with more than a polite, "Thanks."

[daddytodd.livejournal.com]

One of 411's problems is that the settings seem only to be displayed on the list page, and not on the profile detail pages. If, as I did, you go to the profile page via a link, you will never see the preference of the poser.

So I don't know if these particular profiles have any setting at all.

[daddytodd.livejournal.com]

The "I want to have sex" angle is especially problematcc when he's in Italy or Brazil, and I'm in Utah. If you've invented a transporter, feel free to beam over, otherwise... send me a plane ticket! hehe!

[daddytodd.livejournal.com]

Very odd, that... But to each his own. I work very hard to respect his wishes, but sometimes it just sort of slips out, usually when I'm thinking about him in nasty ways...

[daddytodd.livejournal.com]

Oh, and I swear to god that my antipathy towards "Don't call me boi..." has nothing to do with the fact that he's a 20something hairless twink who could be an Aberzombie and Fitch model. I mean, what the fuck is he doing on BEAR411 at all? Huh? Answer me that!

Absolutely no connection between those two things at all. No sir, completely unrelated, I swear.

;-)

[bitterlawngnome.livejournal.com]

I don't think it's altogether a bad thing ... one needs to learn to differentiate what happens in a fantasy setting, and what's real life. And on another level, to appreciate that service / submission / etc actually can be a good thing, and enrich both people involved. In other words "son" or "boy" isn't necessarily a swearword.

[carytown.livejournal.com]

I've stopped trying to figure it out. It's pretty much like the real world. Met some fantastic friends and fuckbuds there. And quite a few bozo's as well. And I find everyting in-between as well.

[daddytodd.livejournal.com]

It also should represent a certain kind of emotional commitment / support on the part of the "daddy" towards the "boy," in addition to an indication of relative hierarchical position in the pack.

Even daddies need a daddy; even boys need a boy. There is no absolute top or absolute bottom.

All daddies were once boys; all boys grow up to be daddies...

[joelbear.livejournal.com]

Cary beat me to it. I agree with him. I have met some neat guys to have sex with, some neat guys to have dinner with. A lot of freaks, players and liars and just plain mean guys. Everything in between. I find it a fascinating sociological soup.

[bitterlawngnome.livejournal.com]

I think for some people it can be a way of reclaiming those relationships in a way that is supportive rather than punishing.

[daddytodd.livejournal.com]

Absolutely. If it becomes about manipulation or a power grab, run away from it. If the "daddy" isn't nurturing the "boy," then the boy needs to leave and find a better daddy.

[kymutt.livejournal.com]

I have chatted quite a bit on bear411. I agree with a few points, especially the 'just friends with nudes' profiles. As far as the daddy/boy thing...I don't mind it if it's someone I feel has earned the right to call me that. But if the first thing a person says to me is boy, they're gonna get a kind rebuttal. Okay, so I'm ramblin', but I think you get my point. If not, catch me later.

[daddytodd.livejournal.com]

At the risk of stating the obvious, calling a black man "boy" is problematic on several levels. I made sure to get your permission before using the "b" word with you.

I do get your point, handsome! Like I already said, I think leading off with "boy" is inappropriate unless the profile specifically and unambiguously requests it.

[dakoopst.livejournal.com]

Well, for many folks, 411 ISN'T a hookup site...

[asthmaboy.livejournal.com]

Exactly. It's disrespectful if it's clearly stated not to say someting to them.
However, if it''s not listed as "don't call me this or that", it's all fair game.

[asthmaboy.livejournal.com]

If I'm not mistaken, all the bears sites are for bears, cubs, chasers, etc.
He, in this case, would be a chaser. :P

[in-fin-i-ty.livejournal.com]

I freely admit that Bear411 is less a hookup site for me than a social/chat/replacement-for-gay.com venue. Part of this is due to a constantly changing schedule which is often not conducive to more 'traditional' social interactions. So I hop on Bear411 for some gab.

But I get frustrated 'cuz I clearly state on my profile not only the bear4friends but that I'm NOT looking for dates, hookups or boyfriends. Still I get all sorts of guys who either just want to fuck or are looking for their next ex. In fact right now I'm dealing with two guys who seem to think they have some magical power that will somehow slap a wedding band on my finger. ARGH.

"Wand of Magic Marriage (doubles treasure) meet Cloak of Frozen Heart (+15 AC against desperate enemies)"

I disagree with your second guy that 'taken' doesn't always mean not up for fun but I think the biggest thing is that, if someone has gone to the trouble of writing a bunch of information, it's a bit rude to just ignore it. On the other hand I don't think it's out of line to say something like, "I know you're just here for friends but I had to say you're very attractive." Of course that's different than being all, "YER HOT. LETS FUK!"

[daddytodd.livejournal.com]

A number of friends of mine who are cubs and chasers and otters and wolves have been refused admittance to Bear411 based on some perceived lack of "bearishness."

But that's not the Aberzombie's fault. And I don't blame him. No, I don't.

[asthmaboy.livejournal.com]

That's absolute bullshit. I can't believe people would be refused admittance.

[daddytodd.livejournal.com]

But some guys take the the "profile" to an absurd extreme, writing paragraphs about what an asshole their ex was, and hot you'd better not be the same kind of asshole, and if you are DON'T BOTHER!

I also have an issue with profiles that say they're looking for "a hot guy" but neglect to define "hot." Like, how do I know I'm NOT his ideal of hotness?

[daddytodd.livejournal.com]

Sad but true. It's one of the main reasons I'm going to let my subscription to 411 lapse.

[in-fin-i-ty.livejournal.com]

But some guys take the the "profile" to an absurd extreme, writing paragraphs...

(like me (http://www.BEAR411.com/leatherotter)? *heh*) True. I don't mean to sound like you have to make an indepth study, of course. Sometimes I just skim through for major points. Plus if they're really that bad then I probably won't IM them anyways since they sound like drama with a side of migraine. :/

AND WHY????

[cmhphil.livejournal.com]

And why, in the NAME OF GOD why do they profess their preferences (TOP BOTTOM VERSATILE) Their penis size or nude pictures if they are not into "hooking up" or jut looking for friends. I do not need to know the penis size of my friends.

And why is ANYONE still obtuse enough to say "straight-acting" when masculine will do?


And in some defense, I am not really "looking" to hook up, but I don't rule out it happening either. In fact, most of the other men I talk to are other widowers. I met my current boyfriend there, and we met face to face in July after chatting for about a month.

I am not offended by being hit on, because it hapens in person too, and I am not locking myself away from real life just to avoid potential sexual contact. If I really intended to maintain a monogamous relationship or intend to never get hit on, I would quit Bear411 and Bearwww, start a Gay Widowers group in Yahoo, and quit going out and stop flirting all together.

I refuse to stop flirting. It is one of my best skills!

[asthmaboy.livejournal.com]

Ugh.
I'd rather have a membership to bearwww, anyways. :)

Re: AND WHY????

[asthmaboy.livejournal.com]

And why, in the NAME OF GOD why do they profess their preferences (TOP BOTTOM VERSATILE) Their penis size or nude pictures if they are not into "hooking up" or jut looking for friends. I do not need to know the penis size of my friends.

Fantasies are best when you know the good parts, but not everything... :)

[tky2k5.livejournal.com]

I think some people take that site a little too seriously, including the owner.
What I don't understand is why someone who gets offended by getting offers for sex would post a profile on a website like that. Not that the site is about sex exclusively, but honestly, what was he expecting?

[daddytodd.livejournal.com]

Oh dude, you're totally an amateur compared to some guys who have profiles that scroll for 2 or 3 PAGES or angst. No, your profile is not one of the "offenders" in that regard.

But I gotta ask you, wanna hook up?

Hehe!

[daddytodd.livejournal.com]

Yes. Exactly. What you said.

[asthmaboy.livejournal.com]

I hate to justify the guy, but he thought people would have the decency not to contact him if he asks for that.

Wait, I do hate to justify him for that.
People are stupid on the whole.

[danthered.livejournal.com]

I work very hard to respect his wishes

I'm quite sure he genuinely appreciates your efforts to respect his wishes, even if you don't yet understand them.

[tmaher.livejournal.com]

My partner Ron has been vexed lately by the messages that he has been getting from Bear411 denizens. They write him to say, "You would look handsome without that beard." We are not sure "what part of Bear don't you understand?"

FREAKS.